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The two tries by Robber O'Davis in GF97 may have been feats of dexterity rather than strength, but without the assistance of being juiced up, the Knights players throughout the game wouldn't have been performing at the same level. They wouldn't have even been in a position to score, maybe not even in the game.
Bastards.
Jaxx
As I am about to write this email, I hear that another Knight has tested positive!!! can you believe it! - Allan McDougal - the shit who kicked Geoff.
I also read in the paper that there was no drug testing of players after last year's Grand Final.
Now we all know there is no way of knowing how deserving the Knights were winning the Grand final. But can the powers that be, at least, get every player (yes even Manly players) to sign Statute Declarations (or some other legal document) that they were not on performance enhancing drugs during the Grand final. I know it may be fairly worthless, but at least the one's who refuse are most likely admitting guilt. Maybe even publishing those whose signed wouldn't be a bad idea. At least it might put a bit of pressure on the guilty. Of course there is the possiblity that none were positive, but who would believe that now? It would not be realistic to give Manly the premiership, but if indeed it were found that there were players who where positive, then the Kights should be stripped of the premiership.
Let's see what type of Knights they are, how many would declare publically that they were not on drugs during the Grand Final.
Well done again Manly. Glad to see Colella had a big game - he'd been showing so much potential. I also want to say that any disgruntled Saints supporters are better off voicing their opinions on their own team's home page as they won't get any sympathy from us.
Simone
First of all, I would just like to say how disgraced I was with the referees performence last Sunday out at Brookevale. The final penalty count was 7-1 in favour of the Manly side and Terry Hill's high shot on St.George's Corey Pearson was without a doubt, a send off offence. The Sea-Eagles ran home 34-12 winners over the dragons but not due to the style of play, but to the favouritism of the referee towards the Sea-Eagles. Just like in the 96 Grand Final...
Unpleased Saints supporter
With talk of some former Eastern European athletes handing in their tarnished medals, one wonder's how 'noble' will the Knights be & do the same.... Yeah sure!
We all know the only honourable thing for them to do, & to get back their respectablitity & credablity(for them & the league), is to relinquish last year's premiership to Manly. But everyone knows there's Buckley's of that happening. Then the least they could do is return their 'rings' & trophy back to the ARL & atone for their guilt,... yeah sure!. The highest steriod reading for any Australian athelete, speaks for itself....shame Newcastle, shame.
GO the Eagles....
Well you have to agree that in hindsight we were robbed in '95 and '97. Certainly since the start of the nineties we have probably been the most high profile team to have morals - no drugs no salary cap infringements.
So what happened this year - well again it seems to come down to fair play. Manl y knew that in 1999 that a new salary cap was coming (this has since been extend ed one year), and had to lose players - that way they could afford the players t hey needed - It would have been expected that many players would have been on of fer from other clubs.
Therefore it is my belief that Craig Innes was allowed to go on the same premise.
Wait till all the other clubs need to do it. Manly are financial and this appears to be paramount for long term existence. Which we will see in two years as the only stand alone club in Sydney. (unless of course we decide to merge with Manly reserve grade - Balmain)
I enjoyed seeing Newcastle beat Manly, I was a pomme in your country just visiting at the time of the Grand Finals, and to me on first impression your team was a bit full of themselves so it was good to see Robbie O'Davis score two tries, and the way Newcastle won the match was excellent viewing. I don't think theres much hope me back in pomme land though my local English team is Salford Reds!!!!
Well as a loyal supporter who has travelled down from the Bush to see my beloved Eagles play in every Grand Final since the mid 70's I am now bitterly disapointed to have heard that last years win by Newcastle has now been tarnished with the Robbie O'Davis affair.
I ask the question, if he was using performance enhancing drugs then how many more in the Newcastle Team were doing so as well ??
I was there last year and watched Newcastle just coming back and coming back after being battered by Spud and Co for 80 minutes.
I know we can't change history but talk about being upset I now know how the Olympic athletes must feel when they lose a race and the winner is accused of drug taking (for example the female swimmer from Ireland Michelle Smith who is currently dodging drug tests all over the world).
Despite Manly's bad image in the past of trying to buy premierships there is at least one thing they can never be accused of and that is winning Grand Finals with drugged up players.
You may not all agree with my comments but anyone who watched the game last year will have to agree "WE WAS ROBBED"
Mark from Moree
As there is a world wide move to get athletes who have tested positive to drugs to give their gold medals to the runners up I propose that if Robbie O Davis is found guilty Newcastle be made to give last years premiership to the rightful holders Manly.
It must be remembered that Robbie O Davis was Man of the Match in last years grand final and it was his efforts that kept Newcastle in it. Of course it should now enrage all fair minded people that Manly, the paragon of fair play and good sportsmanship, should have lost out to those drug cheats Newcastle.
Canterbury too should be made to give 1995's title to Manly as Peter Moore laughingly and sneeringly admitted in Rugby League Week that Canterbury had deliberately violated the salary cap.
I would like to say one other thing to all other fans of ARL loyal clubs who now gloat at Manly's current (temporary) form slump. The reason I believe that Manly did not have the money to retain Spud Carroll and other players was because as far as I know they were the only club who weathered the Super League madness without the backing of either Optus or News Ltd. Indeed they were the singularly determined club who stopped Super League because Manly were the one team Super League especially needed to give some creditability to their disgraceful mickey mouse competition.
Of course the piper will have to be paid by clubs such as Canberra, who have several players coming off inflated Super League contracts and may not be willing to take cuts.
I have been a Manly fan for the best part of 34 years but even I have now realized that it's time for Fulton to be given the gold watch and retired from the game. Their recent form has been abysmal (and it really hurts me to say that). Other coaches are sacked for performances by their teams that are nowhere near as bad as Manly's has been this season. I will however, continue to devote myself to the team through thick and thin no matter where they finish.
Toni Vincent
Manly get the raw end of the stick sometimes, but that's probably cause in the past they have been so damn strong.
A group of people I was with recently talked about the demise of teams being represented by locals and the commercialisation of the sport. When someone mentioned my beloved Sea Eagles they all went "Oh, yes, Manly", like they epitomise all that is wrong with the code. I had to remind them that Manly has a number of locals in the team (Hancock, Toovey, Menzies, that I know of) and that a team like the Melbourne Storm doesn't even have a Victorian in the side.
I think there is a plot by Superleague to get rid of Manly. I'll never forget the press Manly and the ARL copped in The Australian newspaper when the war started. That paper (and The Telegraph, Courier-Mail) are nothing more than Rupert Murdoch's company newsletters -- he owns Superleague, Foxtel and a lot of the NRL!
I'm just waiting for the Murdoch press to suggest Manly has no right to stand alone in a 14 team comp because of their very recent form!
Stephen
As a Seaeagle supporter living in Brisbane, but currently holidaying in Adelaide, I still support the team through thick and thin. Coverage in Adelaide is very dismal all you get is stories on the Rams or AFL.
I've gone for the eagles for as long as I can remember,and may I add there are a lot of reasons why we the eagle supporters should still be proud of them.It's fair to say they are having a pretty ordinary year,but one must remember;
1 We have lost in one year the likes of;Carroll/Gilliespie/Innes Two state of origin players as well as Australian reps in spud and cement,Innes a rugby convert in his first year played for NZ.You just can't lose these types of players and expect to keep making the grand final.
2 Manly are the only team pre 1980 never to receive the dreaded wooden spoon,which may I add the likes of St George,Parramatta and the others have done.
3 Before this year Manly were the biggest away pulling crowd team for the last 7 years,which goes to prove that if you don't like them you sure respect them.How many teams can boast that.
4 Manly are by far the most over-all successful side there is given that they are the team that has reached the semi-finals 24 times in the last 28 seasons.
5 they were voted the most devastating side to play in the last 6 seasons.
So if anyone hassles you about supporting the mighty eagles,be sure to remind them of a few of the facts that they simply can't deny.
I think that our point scoring ability is fine,particularly if Cliffy is running the show.It's just our paper defence that's really letting us down.I've been to a few of their matches this year,Easts/Norths/Canberra and who can forget Newcastle,and believe me it really hurt to sit and watch those matches.If any one saw the Cronulla game or even better the home game against Brisbane and saw glimpses of absolute brilliance,absolute Manly at their best it would have made you proud.
Indy!!!
Another win for the mighty Sea Eagles and perhaps the turnaround they had to have to get back on deck for the 1998 season.
Looking at the games remaining (and if they play as well as they did on Sunday) I reckon they could win another 7 games at least which would have them finish on say 22 points. I think about 20 points will be the cutoff does anyone know??? Also this new 10 team finals seems a bit funny to me but I suppose I'll work it out.
By the way does anyone agree that the NRL should take some games into the Country (I'm from the bush). Wouldn't one game a round be great and I am sure the supporters out here would flock to the game. We do feel like we have been a bit left out in the Country, I mean there isn't even a City v Country game these days, fair go you city dwellers think about us for a change.
By the way folks if Geoff Toovey isn't the gutsiest player in the game I'll walk to Bourke backwards, he takes so many knocks and just keeps coming up for more. Although I must say I am a bit concerned when I hear the story that he and Nick Kosef are off to the Bulldogs (I hate them after 1995), does anyone know the story down there??
Go the Eagles and rub those Bulldoggies noses into the dirt this weekend.
Mark from Moree
Manly is the greatest. Manly have produced more internationals than any other team in the comp. We are the most successful, well managed and brilliant team in history. I think people who don't like Manly are envious of the fact that their team will never reach the heights that Manly has. Especially those North Sydney supporters. Some Norths supporters have apparently been committed because of manic depression. Hey, when you haven't won the comp since 1923, it's pretty hard going.
Manly Waringah, our home by the sea. Teach us to live in harmony. Our's is this fairland to hold for evermore.
North Curly boy
I have been a manly supporter for a very large portion of my life. Like so many others I am sick of how everyone is talking about the team. When you look at the team currently in the top 10 - Rooster who have bought their whole team, and, correct me if i am wrong have only one local junior in their line up - Luke Ricketson. St George have also bought a few players the last few years - darren tracey , Darren rameka and Jamie Ainscough to name a few. Then there is Parramatta and north Sydney who have purchased players from everywhere in the last few years.This debunks the theory that manly have bought their suces in the previous years.
I am sure that i do not need to go through the manly team to count out for you the local juniors that are in the team. Manly Will Bounce back - now is the time to stay loyal as they will bounce back , just like they did after 1989 , after 1992 and they wil do this year.
Hey i have to admitt i am not a manly supporter i go for the tigers but thats because my grand father was their president so i grew up with wayne pierce and benny elias as my heros.Manly is my second fav team and i think they have a great spirit i went to their game today. Even though they lost they stilll played a good game! and who am i to say they played crap i can't even play! I have to admit we gained 2 great players from you guys shonnon nevin and shayne anyway all the best hope to see the TIGERS and the SEAEAGLES at the finals!
It can only get better if Manly get a new coach
"Squealers", "abuse" ??
Who's whinging about Manly games being shown on TV ?
Who's accusing Bozo and Lyons of being "clowns" ?
Who's accusing Field of being a "hapless buffalo" and a "joke" ?
Who's talking about "dismal performances" and forgetting about the Norths v
Bribane game ?
It does sound just a tad hypocritical.
The whining and whinging is constant from you lot "they take all our players" or "they get favoured treatment" etc, etc. It just goes on and on !
You carry on like big girls !
Maybe instead of moving north your club could move south and merge with Illawarra and call yourselves The North Sydney Sheilas ?
PS. If we are getting all technical about punctuation and spelling then it's actually Hoppa and not "Hoppo".
Well the news has just filtered through here in England.So I had to find a internet service to find out what is actually happening. I don't exactly know what has happened in the last two weeks but to lose like we have is just unacceptable from a Manly side & I can't except any excuses even though I haven't seen anything. I will be very interested to hear what is going on when I get back in 3 weeks. I'm actually lost for words.
cheers WOODY from LONDON
P.S Sorry Sue but I have to agree with Gareth from Wigan on Danny Moore.The games I have seen him play over here he is killing it.On the other hand Mark Carroll's London Bronco's aren't doing well at all & the first game I saw spud play he got knocked out.
Ahhh abuse, send me more!
Seems some people are a mite touchy by the dismal performances. Quoting Norths - Brisbane when in between there was Norths-Manly and then accusing me of short-term memory! At least his two 2-yr old hasn't run out of fingers for computing Manly's points on the league ladder, nor is she likely to.
Merge with Illawara and call yourselves the Manly Squealers!
PS Even if I can't do maths I do know where to put the apostrophe in has'nt [sic] and could'nt [sic]
To the Smug Bears Supporter,
If Bozo could'nt coach his way out of a parking lot, what does that say about Peter Louis - how many premiership teams has he coached ??
And if you turned the TV on last week and saw Manly behind by 50 then you're a worse mathematician than my 2 year old daughter. The score was 50-16 (34 point difference - it obviously has to be spelt out to you!). What about the Norths v Brisbane match 60-6 I believe - a 54 point thrashing. You obviously have a short memory!
And yes no doubt we will be seeing 3 flags before the next millenium - white flags as evidenced by your pathetic team year in, year out everytime they make the semi-finals.
How can a Bears supporter bag any other club (or its players) when it has'nt won a premiership since 1922 ?
Someone who can remember their last Premiership.
"To the many uninformed, however hardy Manly Rugby League Supporters,"
I read with interest "many" e-mails regarding Manly's 1998 team performance, which is justifiably worth questioning by supporters. I wish to highlight the most repeated questions or complaints, and follow with "my" reasons as to why the team is performing inconsistently.
I refer to the often stated "Forward" problems, the "Cliffy" factor, and what's wrong with "Craig Field".
Manly are missing Mark Carroll up front to complete the "engine room" for the necessary "go forward." Despite this Manly were "not perfect last year" even with Carroll up front, judging by some scrappy performances like the Friday night they let Sydney City cruise to an 18-0 lead after 20min at Brookie, before the eagles came back in a thriller. They had Carroll that night too, remember! Whilst Manly were still clearly the best team overall in 1997, they still had "team playing" problems which I'm sure were noticed by some. Even if Carroll was playing this year, Manly would of been higher on the ladder, but not dominant, as the team combination is not there consistently. Supporters, the blame only rests marginally with the forwards.
Manly's problem last year and in 1998 is their "halves", who very rarely "RUN". When Manly bought Craig Field, they went on a "mission" to change his style of play without any regard for the outstanding natural talent he possessed. I assume, because he was from lowly South Sydney, the coaching staff felt the need to change his style of play. In doing so, they "beefed him up" to improve his goal kicking skills and kicks in general play, as Manly were devoid of a kicker after the loss of Matthew Ridge. This has clearly "backfired", as Field's kicking game is inconsistent, yet worse still, his brilliant free running ability has been "Hobbled" by Manly's policy of bigger is better. Manly should of left Craig Field exactly as they bought him, as a man similar in stature to Geoff Toovey. Craig Field WAS Souths, and apart from his desire to chat to referee's, his game and style overall -- "Did not need changing!"
When Toovey and Field are together, and Field's lack of pace (tell me the last clean break he made, and last time he scored a try?), Manly are putting extra pressure on their forwards to make the break. Field keeps throwing the inside ball as he has no pace anymore to slice through. Toovey is forced to tackle more at five eight and has less energy to keep sprinting through (although he tries like the champion he is).
Now when Cliffy comes on, Toovey then reverts to 'half-back" and thus a return to his natural "Number 7" free running style that takes the pressure off the forwards to keep running. Cliffy does his bit and suddenly Manly are winning. In Rugby League, you must have at least one half who can "RUN" the ball in combination with the forwards going forward. Presently, with Craig Field the way he is, Manly's attack is "stifled", and tires the forwards who we all know are one short at the moment. Don't blame Field, -- "blame the coach" who should of done his homework better and realised what he has done to Craig Field. You cannot "Hobble" a free running half like this guy was at Souths.
When Cliffy does "retire", and assuming the half situation is the same, then Manly will be stuffed. As I alluded to earlier, regardless how strong the forwards are, Manly still won't have a running half-back. The problem is worse now with the further loss of good players. Even in 1997, if not for Cliffy, Manly would of lost quite a few more games when the halves situation was the same as in 1998.
I finally plead to Bob Fulton to look at some videos of Craig Field when he was at South Sydney, and reshape him back to the dashing speedster he was. I was a huge supporter of Craig Field when he played for Souths and cannot believe the change in his style of play. Manly coaching staff -- "wake up!"
Finally, take notice of what Souths delivered to you, and prove the club does not deserve it's "no one else in the competition exists" silvertail attitude.
Dear Rabid Manly Supporter,
Why is it that every weekend when I turn the TV on that Manly are 50 points behind some team? Why do Channel 9 show this bunch of clowns every week? Is it because of Bozo (arch-clown) who couldn't coach his way out of a parking lot (witnessed by NZ defeating Australia)?
Some tips:
Yours,
A Smug Bears Supporter (three flags before the millenium)
As a dedicated supporter of the Seaeagles, I find it hard to accept what has happened to our team of late, however the sheer reality of this, comes to a change in the direction of the game itself. Ability to survive, is the most important thing for Manly as a club and team, so if it means having a season or two of not being as prominent as we are accustomed to, then so be it. Short term loss, for long term gain, Manly have always been an astute club on and off the field, I am sure the culling of players was done for survival, in order to meet a set criteria that will be laid down by the NRL, in the forthcoming weeks. Finances, Ground Facilities, and most important CROWD SUPPORT, will be closely monitored by the powers that be, so lets all get out there and cheer for our mighty SEAEAGLES. In saying this "WE WILL MAKE THE TOP TEN"
Harry K.
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